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getting that 'happy hardcore' lead sound

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thecrazyg
Senior Member

Australia
451 posts
Joined: Jun, 2003

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 01:57:41

So i have vanguard, but other than that, nothing worth mentioning. Ive been messing around with FLStudio for a little while now, I know my way around it. . but I've yet to produce anything that sounds remotely pleasant!

Anyway. . I'm just trying to make an average trancey hardcore lead synth sound, maybe i'm just using the wrong tools - will vanguard be able to do it? If not, can you recommend any other softsynths that can?

is there some secret button called "make happy hardcore sounds" that I'm missing? lol.

please help me, before i go insane!
-gav

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If someone ever asks you why,
you spend your weekends getting high,
theres only ever one reply:
IM HARDCORE UNTIL I DIE!

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Sk8SiM
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
1,293 posts
Joined: Nov, 2004

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 06:24:50

WOOT - OMG!!!

IMO Vanguard is the most user friendly and most easy to use VST there is...(in otherwords, shite!)

Its fantastic don't get me wrong...

But I only found out about it a few months back and the past year I was using superwave... and other VST's...

The type of VST's where when you load up a preset... you've GOT TO!!! (no if ands or butts) fine tune it in order to get that perfect sound... and THAT was a frustrating process learning but I don't regret it one bit cuse it get results and these days I know what I’m doing...

Vanguard on the other hand... the presets in it are just like... wtf ITS ALL DONE FOR YOU!!!!

It Evan has its own reverb and delay...
See normally you'd have to add that yourself in the mixer when you go to master your work... lol

So Where Is This "Magic Button" Then...?

Well... in FL studio in the VERY top left hand corner of the vanguard window... you'll see what looks like a "plug" right next to the name...

Click it... go on...

Then scroll down to "presets" and WALA!!!!
A load of new sounds!!!

You can also change them by click the 2 arrows (left and right) in the other corner right next to the "close" button

If you can't make a decent "sounding" hardcore tune now... I will be AMAZED!!!

Honestly... it really does makes it sooo easy...

Vanguard is the most pussy friendly VST there is...

Don’t get me wrong though... it’s a very very good VST...

Just it means people can just pick it up and make a tune that would probs sound better then someone who has spent alot of time fine-tuning a very complex track...

It’s all about that "catchy" melody end of the day... If you can make one... your in...

Btw mate... if your getting frustrated over that... honestly.... give it a few months and if and when you decide to REALLY take producing on board as a new found talent... then, lets just say your in for a treat…

Firstly you’ll have to learn how to structure a tune correctly so it mixs well (using stuff like virtual DJ) - this is very frustrating at first...

Then you'll need to learn how to master (fine tune) your work...
So everything sounds how it should sound... making your work sound more "FULL" and making sure the wave form of the overall track (master audio) doesn't clip (means its too load)...

And then there’s the real head act... AUDIO COMPRESSION!!!!
If you want your track to mix well on vinyl... YOU NEED TO LEARN IT!!!
Trust me I'm still getting head acts over it myself....

Basically it automatically will stop your track from clipping... and make everything in the wave form the same length (same vol)

i.e. your intos and outros will always be not as load as your leads... basically can't be mixed cuse as you slide the fader it will just feel like your fading the whole of one track to another!

Audio compression will make sure every "part of your track" reaches the peak of the wave form...

It’s also used to make things flow trough the rest of the mix (track/song) more cleary...
Example... your kicks should be the loudest part of your track, but audio compression will make everything else (hihats, claps, melodies, bass ect) flow trough smoothly instead of the kick just drowning everything else out...

However… it can also make things sound out of place…

Like something that sounds really quilt while something else thats really load is over it (kicks for example)… will sound REALLY loud when the kicks are removed…

This can make you go “Oh Gawd” or “Jesus that sounds shit”

But with the correct use of audio compression in a well mastered track will shove this…

It’s all complicated... it’s like the "maths of music" as my good friend rob (StiffeII) would say...

Other then audio compression, there’s stuff like stereo enhasment, filters, reverb, phasers, delay ect ect that you can add to channels to make things sound better with each other… but these ent as important as the above

Anyways... hope that all helps you

and gives you a little taster of what you should be expecting...

One thing though... don't make your first track thinking it’s fantastic and then posting it on aloud of forums...

Believe me I've done it

... search this very forum for a track called "always there" by Sk8SiM

Hehe - yep that me

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DJ SiMUl8 Presents SiMPliciTy!
<b>To Be Open Minded... Is To Open Your Mind!</b>
http://www.myspace.com/Sk8SiM
Sk8SiM/Morrall Studios.

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Edited by - Sk8SiM on 2006/05/26 06:39:05

Phobz
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
893 posts
Joined: Jan, 2006

13 hardcore releases

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 09:30:26

I tend to just use the kraft chord preset then just tune it up to my liking, If you're after really happy sounding synth try changing the osc's. Square and sawtooth are cool for synths but there are plenty of other oscillator's you can use aswell, It also depends on your note arrangement in piano roll though :D

Have you tried zeta+, very nice for synths, arps, strings etc :)

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thecrazyg
Senior Member

Australia
451 posts
Joined: Jun, 2003

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 12:54:16

First up . . no offence sk8sim, but apart from going completely off on a different tangent to my question, you've got me all wrong. Dont make so many assumptions about people! ;)

Thanks phobz, thats more of an answer to my question! Ill check out zeta+ too.

__________________________________
******************************************
If someone ever asks you why,
you spend your weekends getting high,
theres only ever one reply:
IM HARDCORE UNTIL I DIE!

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Hard2Get
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
12,837 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 13:06:13

quote:
Originally posted by thecrazyg:
So i have vanguard, but other than that, nothing worth mentioning. Ive been messing around with FLStudio for a little while now, I know my way around it. . but I've yet to produce anything that sounds remotely pleasant!

Anyway. . I'm just trying to make an average trancey hardcore lead synth sound, maybe i'm just using the wrong tools - will vanguard be able to do it? If not, can you recommend any other softsynths that can?

is there some secret button called "make happy hardcore sounds" that I'm missing? lol.

please help me, before i go insane!
-gav

It's all about the V-Station for Trance leads :) Check out mine in a couple of tunes i have at www.myspace.com/matthard2gethardcore

If that's the kind of sound you want, let me know :)

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bulby_g
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
7,205 posts
Joined: Apr, 2004

430 hardcore releases

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 13:23:57

Yeah I find V-station and Superwave Trance Pro much better than Vanguard for good leads TBH. Have never tried zeta + but I have been recommended it a few times... No idea what it's like really.

If all you have is Vanguard and don't have money to spare at the mo then as Phobz has said the nearest preset to an average hardcore lead is kraft chord. Do a bit of tweaking on that and you can get something near to a Scott Brown type of lead sound. I would advise you to turn off vanguards reverb and use your own as it's not very nice IMO.

Am planning on getting a hardware synth myself :) just need a bit more cash and to make up my mind on which one I want...

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eLASTIC
Advanced Member

Australia
637 posts
Joined: Mar, 2005

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 15:03:02

Vstation, z3ta, pro53, superwave trancepro, adventus softplug, linplug octopus.

Then you just gotta tweak, program, eq and apply fx to your liking ; )

But you will find a lotter presets and banks out there already have similar if not the particular sound you want.

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thecrazyg
Senior Member

Australia
451 posts
Joined: Jun, 2003

Posted - 2006/05/26 : 15:19:23

quote:
as Phobz has said the nearest preset to an average hardcore lead is kraft chord. Do a bit of tweaking on that and you can get something near to a Scott Brown type of lead sound.

hahaha, its like scott brown in a can! :D

Once you get a half reasonable synth sound, the melodies come naturally. . well. . partly lol. . still need "some" (some = lots of) work :P

Thanks for the help guys. . at least being able to produce a half decent sound to work with has led me on the path to inspiration! I was about to give up.

__________________________________
******************************************
If someone ever asks you why,
you spend your weekends getting high,
theres only ever one reply:
IM HARDCORE UNTIL I DIE!

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Edited by - thecrazyg on 2006/05/26 15:21:22

StrifeII
Advanced Member

United Kingdom
2,143 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001

Posted - 2006/05/28 : 15:14:26

You're talkin about supersaws right?
Best ones (software wise) come from NI Reaktor but good luck programming it :)
Vanguard is really overused in hardcore imo. Same presets all the time too :/
Quality wise your best bet is as matt said V-Station, z3ta+ or Superwavep8 (virus emulation vsti.)
From scratch: Grab some saw waves, detune them against each other, delay, reverb, eq boost and a little exciter on the highs, then set a filter envelope on the delay. Sorry if this is a little vague, but its not easy to build a good trance synth :)

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milo
Advanced Member

Canada
3,391 posts
Joined: Sep, 2001

347 hardcore releases

Posted - 2006/05/28 : 15:38:36

^^^ yah, pile on the detuned saws a couple layers deep. thing to remember with presets is everyone is using those presets, so you don't get a unique sound. V-station is great for a quick and easy one. Also, if you want trance-in-your-pants, use the korg legacy cell, that thing is a beast, but it can really churn out the trance.

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HappyHardcore.com/North American Hardcore Movement/Totally Sweet Radio/Hardcore Street Team

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Owen P
Average Member

United Kingdom
154 posts
Joined: Nov, 2005

Posted - 2006/05/28 : 23:18:02

Cronox 3 could silence any of the synths mentioned in this thread with 2 oscillators tied behind it's back.

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http://www.hattrixx.co.uk/

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GaryMaguireXL
Senior Member

Ireland
360 posts
Joined: Apr, 2004

Posted - 2006/06/20 : 00:35:18

All About Vstation and Korg Legacy.Havn't tried Cronox.

My advice would be to give synthesis a shot.That way you will know exactly what your doing with a synth and program the sound that your looking for.There is loads of tutorials on Google etc on Subtractive synthesis.

Now for Vanguard, IMO!!! its the worst synth out there for leads.use it to layer a few pads and fxs but the leads are awful.The filter is horrible and as bubly said earlier the Reverb is rotten.It has a distinct sound and IMO!! its a horrible one.

Hope it helps

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Owen P
Average Member

United Kingdom
154 posts
Joined: Nov, 2005

Posted - 2006/06/21 : 12:10:26

quote:
Originally posted by GaryMaguireXL:
All About Vstation and Korg Legacy.Havn't tried Cronox.

Then how can you be so sure? I've put VStation and Korg Legacy to extensive use, and while they're pretty good - Cronox wipes the floor with them.

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marchhare
Senior Member

United States
370 posts
Joined: Jul, 2003

Posted - 2006/06/21 : 21:55:43

I have vangaurd as well.As far as producing anything that sounds good.....hahahahaha I still suck I wish I could help you .I am sure some one on here can.maybe try going in the back topics of this section and see if any one has had the same questain.

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GaryMaguireXL
Senior Member

Ireland
360 posts
Joined: Apr, 2004

Posted - 2006/06/22 : 18:23:50

quote:
Originally posted by Owen P:

quote:
Originally posted by GaryMaguireXL:
All About Vstation and Korg Legacy.Havn't tried Cronox.

Then how can you be so sure? I've put VStation and Korg Legacy to extensive use, and while they're pretty good - Cronox wipes the floor with them.